In Talleyrand's view, France's biggest problem was that before the war, it rejected the Ming Dynasty and chose Britain.
Although the decision-making at the time basically had nothing to do with Talleyrand, through the news and information at the time, Talleyrand knew very well what the entire process was like.
Talleyrand could understand that the Ming emperor, princes, and officials had reasons to hold grudges for this, and thus refused to reconcile with France.
But Talleyrand also understood that national exchanges are not a battle of personal wills.
If the Emperor of Ming Dynasty really chose this way, then at least he could not be considered a wise emperor.
Judging from his past experience, the Emperor of Ming Dynasty was obviously not a man who acted on impulse.
As for Prince Dashi, who presided over the negotiations, he was only fifteen years old this year and might not even remember anything before the war started.
Even if he becomes angry after seeing the information, the diplomats around him will dissuade him.
However, what Talleyrand saw now was that everyone from the diplomats to the princes of the Ming Dynasty had the word "rejection" on their faces.
Talleyrand could never find an entry point, so he could only directly come up with the conditions that France could offer to see if Ming Dynasty would respond.
France did not cede many places directly, but gave up many places to fight for.
Although most of it was bad land, the Ming Dynasty was able to enter the east coast of Yinzhou and directly intervene in North Atlantic affairs.
This change in situation should be difficult for Ming to refuse.
If Ming Dynasty really does not accept this condition, it can only choose a twenty-year peace treaty.
It was impossible to hand over the entire Yinzhou colony. Ming could only get it through war.
The current Yinzhou French District is not what it was at the same time in history. It is a place that is impossible to give up.
There are now more than 20 million French-speaking Thai-Spanish immigrants there, and they have a very developed industry. They are already a de facto secondary mainland.
France's colonial method was different from that of Britain. It originally ran some colonies as if they were native lands.
Therefore, unless the Ming Dynasty could completely defeat France in the Yinzhou colony or mainland, France would not be able to cede the entire Yinzhou colony.
Threats of homeland war were of no use.
Zhu Jingyuan listened to Talleyrand's suggestion, frowned and said:
“The waters of the Great Lakes and the St. Lawrence River, as well as the islands in the lakes, all belong to the Ming Dynasty.
“The abandoned area includes all islands north of the current area, including Xinfa Island.
"In addition, we will compensate another 10 million Ming Dynasty gold coins."
Talleyrand immediately breathed a sigh of relief, Ming was indeed willing to talk.
The previous repeated refusals only required France to admit its mistakes and show sincerity.
But Talleyrand's heart was twitching again.
For a country of France's level, the compensation equivalent to tens of billions of yuan is actually not a particularly big problem.
But if the Great Lakes and the rivers connecting the Atlantic Ocean were all owned by the Ming Dynasty, the unique transportation conditions of the French Great Lakes region would be gone.
Talleyrand's instinctive response demanded:
“The land around Lake Michigan was not transferred to Daming, so of course the waters cannot belong to Daming.
"The waters of other lakes and related rivers must allow French ships to navigate, and Ming Dynasty may not prohibit them for any reason."
Zhu Jingyuan changed the conditions again:
"Only civilian ships are allowed to pass. The security of the lake is handled by the Jinyiwei of the Ming Dynasty. France is not allowed to interfere for any reason."
Talleyrand took a deep breath:
“The handling of relevant personnel must follow universal legal principles and not be handled at will by the Ming Dynasty Jinyiwei.
"In cases involving France, there should be French dispatch agencies supervising their rationality."
Zhu Jingyuan laughed dryly and said:
"There is no need for your on-site supervision. Jinyiwei will handle it in accordance with the laws of the Ming Dynasty. The relevant processing process and results will be reported to France."
Talleyrand was silent for a few seconds, and finally nodded resignedly:
"Okay, but I need time to convince His Majesty the King before I can give a final answer."
Zhu Jingyuan nodded slightly and then picked up the tea cup.
Talleyrand bowed and retired.
After Talleyrand left, Zhu Jingyuan looked at Shen Fu on the other side:
"Shen Shaoqing, will the British come today?"
Shen Fu checked the weather:
"I guess not. The situation in the UK is more complicated than in France, and their own internal communication will also take enough time."
Zhu Jingyuan nodded lightly, said goodbye to his ninth uncle, and went back to read the reports of the craftsmen.
Now the design of several new ships has reached a critical node, but there are differences again in the design direction.
Throughout the afternoon today, the British did communicate internally.
The people who were most affected by the new naval weapons introduced by the Ming Dynasty were actually the British.
The United Kingdom is the only island country among the major countries in the West. It is an absolute maritime country, and its navy is their foundation and lifeblood.
The competition between Britain and Ming Dynasty mainly focused on the sea.
Although the Ming Dynasty's navy had the advantage in the past, since the completion of the industrial revolution, the gap between the British navy and the Ming Dynasty has been continuously narrowing.
Before the Ming Dynasty built its dreadnoughts and hard-hooded armor-piercing projectiles, the technological gap between the two navies had narrowed down to the level of process details.
The British now also realize the feasibility of using the same full-caliber main gun to strike at long range.
In fact, only the British fully understood the new naval gun tactics introduced by the Ming Dynasty today, so the British representatives became the most nervous people.
After lunch that day, in the courtyard where the British representatives lived, the Prince of Wales, Pitt, Monroe, Nelson, Collingwood, and Wellesley, the six most important representatives of the British mission, were in a small living room. Gathered.
The host of the internal meeting was still Prime Minister Pitt, but the protagonist was Admiral Nelson.
Everyone expected Nelson to first analyze the threat of Ming Dynasty's naval guns, and then everyone would re-formulate negotiation strategies based on this threat.
As a result, Nelson began to make demands when he came up, seizing every opportunity to make his own demands:
"I hope that His Royal Highness the Prince, the Prime Minister, all ministers, and gentlemen can support my plan for a full-caliber main gun warship.
“According to this plan, design can be started as soon as possible, construction and actual testing can be started as soon as possible...
“The best carrier of the combat method that Ming Dynasty demonstrated today is the kind of battleship with large-caliber main guns that I planned.
“Since the Ming Dynasty has demonstrated this method of combat, it is obvious that it already has the same understanding, and it is only a matter of time before it builds similar warships.
“I can now tell you with certainty that after this new type of warship becomes combat effective, all previous capital ships will be quickly eliminated.
"Ten kilometers versus five kilometers, twice the theoretical combat distance, can directly subvert the existing naval combat methods.
"Don't worry about the hit problem. Everyone saw in today's test that after achieving cross-fire, almost ten shells can hit one.
“If a warship is equipped with ten main guns of the same caliber, theoretically a full salvo can achieve one hit.
"The lethality of large-caliber naval guns against normal warships is very considerable.
"As long as seven to nine hits are sustained, and three to five are lucky, a capital ship can lose most of its combat effectiveness.
"So this tactic is completely feasible. On this type of battlefield, all existing warships are scrap metal!
“In the past, the Navy Ministry rejected my proposal because Ming Dynasty did not design or build similar warships.
“Now we can see that Daming’s thinking coincides with ours.
“We must implement it as quickly as possible—as quickly as possible!”
Nelson has said similar words too many times before, but the results he achieved before were relatively limited.
The reason is that Ming Dynasty didn't do that.
Today the situation is completely different.
Today, Prime Minister Pitt nodded without hesitation and said:
"I understand what Lord Nelson means, and I will have both the Cabinet and the Admiralty support your suggestions.
"But now there is a problem. Although our warships can fight at ten kilometers, we cannot penetrate the armor of Ming's warships.
"This is what we are really worried about. Da Ming has obviously developed some new technology, and it is impossible for them to make it public.
"Does Mr. Nelson have any reasonable analysis and conjecture in this regard? Which direction should we start from?"
Nelson was prepared for this:
“According to my observations at the time, the flight time of Daming’s new artillery shells over the same distance was slightly shorter than ours.
“This means that their projectiles are flying faster, or the effect of velocity decay over time is smaller.
"This in turn proves that their shells should be heavier and certainly harder, and we can explore those directions.
“Develop a stronger bore that can withstand more energy released by the propellant and provide a higher boring speed for the shells.
“Develop heavier and stronger artillery shells to increase the energy carried by the shells at the same speed, while maintaining flight speed and increasing penetration capabilities.
"Of course we can work in two directions at the same time. Ming Dynasty's metallurgical casting capabilities are stronger than ours, so it is normal to make better cannons and shells.
“If our factory cannot solve the process problem, we can directly use a larger caliber to directly increase the overall power of the naval gun.
"I will write a detailed report and give it to the prime minister and ministers for reference."
Nelson's perception was very keen, and his logic of judgment was certainly correct, but the conclusion he reached was off track.
The naval guns and artillery shells tested by Ming Dynasty today are not significantly different from the current conventional artillery shells in terms of powder charge, shell weight and boring speed.
The flight time of Ming's shells became shorter, not because more propellant was used, nor because the weight could maintain speed.
Because the "head shape" of the Ming Dynasty's cannonballs is sharper, which reduces the resistance during flight, it flies faster.
Under normal circumstances, if the cannonball itself is sharper, the tip of the projectile is more likely to be broken by the armor, so Nelson did not think about it.
In fact, the "body" of Ming Dynasty's new cannonball is not sharp, and the head is even rounder, blunter and flatter.
But Zhu Jingyuan put a hollow pointed hat on its head...
The level of craftsmanship in Britain is not as good as that of Ming Dynasty. If you can't think of a clever solution and just work hard on craftsmanship, the process will definitely be very painful.
Of course, Pitt and other British officials did not know these things, and they all felt that what Nelson said was very reasonable.
Pete nodded slightly, indicating that he had taken note of Nelson's words, and then continued to ask:
"Based on the current state of naval equipment, what suggestions does Lord Nelson have for our negotiations with the Ming Dynasty?"
Nelson said very decisively:
"Pursue peace, pursue permanent peace as much as possible, and buy more time for our navy to develop.
“Before we join forces with the fleets of the French, Spanish, and Portuguese and can defeat the Ming fleet in the Atlantic Ocean.
"We should maintain as friendly and even cooperative a relationship as possible with Ming Dynasty, just like before the war."
Peter frowned and thought about the feasibility of this suggestion. The Prince of Wales couldn't help but speak:
"Lord Nelson, of course we understand that in order to avoid being isolated by other countries on the European continent, we in the UK should also strive for a permanent peace commitment.
"But you should have read the minutes of the meeting. The price demanded by Ming Dynasty for permanent peace is the entire South Tianzhu, so do you mean to ask us to hand over South Tianzhu directly?"
Nelson didn't know how to answer, and Peter next to him quickly helped explain:
“Your Highness, the situation is different.
“At that time, we were preparing to establish a colonial alliance with France, Spain, and Portugal, and we were prepared to accept a twenty-year peace treaty at the same time.
"Prince Dashi was obviously hostile to us at that time, and he was deliberately responding to my difficult questions to him.
"That shouldn't be his true expression. Ming's ideal goal shouldn't be like that..."
The Prince of Wales relaxed slightly, and Nelson nodded slightly.
Peter originally thought that this topic should be over.
As a result, Monroe next to him nodded and opened another:
"The Ming Dynasty's ideal goal has been clearly revealed in previous negotiations. They want us Taixi people to return to the continent of Europa."
The Prince of Wales was startled again, and said loudly in great surprise:
"Drive all our Teishi people back to Europa... How could they have such an idea? How can we talk about permanent peace like this?"
Peter glared at Monroe, feeling that this guy was talking nonsense, and at the same time quickly explained to the Prince of Wales again:
"So this is just an ideal goal. Mr. Monroe was born in the American colonies, so he is most sensitive to this matter.
“In fact, this is an impossible goal and it is not necessary to achieve it.
"Like the French and the Prussians, and the Lucians, and even us Brits, we all want to unite Europe.
“But that’s a goal that will never be achieved.
“They themselves know this very well, so they must have more real goals.
"Just like we have long been committed to maintaining a balance of power among the countries in the European continent and preventing other countries from unifying Europe."
The Prince of Wales immediately asked:
"Then what is Ming's real goal?"
Peter quickly organized his answer in words:
“The Ming Dynasty’s goal should be to control the central waters of Yinzhou and at the same time control the North Atlantic coastline in the southeastern part of Yinzhou.
“Then the Ming Dynasty colony, which was limited to the west coast of Yinzhou, expanded to the east coast.
"So, Ming's real goal should be from Florida to Honey River, plus the ownership of the disputed area in central Yinzhou.
“Dashi actually knows how difficult it is to attack our mainland, which is different from Spain and France.
"So the conditions we need to pay are definitely lower than those of France and Spain.
“I think it’s worthwhile to give up these areas in exchange for Ming’s permanent peace treaty.
"After signing the permanent peace treaty, as long as we stop deliberately provoking Ming Dynasty, Ming Dynasty will not take the initiative to launch a war against us."
When Peter spoke, the other representatives nodded, feeling that Peter's analysis made sense.
But Monroe was obviously a little excited.
Monroe was a representative of the American colony in Yinzhou, and was of course very sensitive to this topic.
Monroe endured until Peter finished speaking, and then immediately stood up and objected sternly:
"Your Excellency, Prime Minister, completely giving up the right to develop central Yinzhou, ceding the Florida area, and giving up the southern coastline of Yinzhou will seriously damage the interests of the American colonies.
"There will definitely be strong opposition from all walks of life in the American colonies, so please, the Prime Minister, please consider it carefully."
Of course, Peter understood this, so he instinctively comforted Monroe:
"Mr. Monroe, don't worry, we can't be 'motivated', we should focus on reality.
“There is no settlement of ours in central Yinzhou, so it is not actually our land.
“Florida is hot and rainy all year round, and the dense jungles and swamps are full of alligators.
“It’s not suitable for us Thais to live there, so immigration is the least.
"You should know these situations better than I do."
Monroe knew that Pete was telling the truth.
But Monroe instinctively believed that the American region was equivalent to Scotland and was already a political entity.
In other words, the immigrant archipelago of America has begun to form a preliminary national consciousness.
To abandon the central Yinzhou Plain is to abandon the future development prospects of the United States.
To cede Florida was to abandon the long southern coastline.
This is intolerable to Americans.
While Monroe was stunned and melancholy, the Prince of Wales closed his eyes and spoke:
“As I recall, Florida didn’t have much industry or population, and the annual tax revenue was very limited.
“It seems to be almost the most desolate place in the entire Yinzhou colony.
“If we change our thinking and no longer insist on protecting the southeastern coastline of Yinzhou, the Florida area actually does not have much value.
“It can even be regarded as the most worthless place in Yinzhou.
"It is indeed worthwhile to hand over Florida in exchange for a permanent peace commitment. It is far better than directly ceding Southern Tianzhu..."
The Prince of Wales' analysis was very reasonable, and the other representatives nodded subconsciously.
If you don't care that the Ming Dynasty occupied the southeastern coastline of Yinzhou, then Florida is indeed of little value to Britain.
Even in later generations, Florida was one of the poorer states in the United States, with per capita income lower than the U.S. average for a long time.
Florida's economy is entirely centered around vacations and retirement, with basically no industry.
But what people in this era value most is industry.
Chimneys all over the floor are the best place!
Munro listened to these people's words and looked at the reactions of these people at the scene, and his body slowly froze.
Monroe had never been so clear-eyed about a real problem.
The area of America where I am located is just a colony of the United Kingdom.
Although it is the most developed colony, it is a colony dominated by Thais.
But it is a colony after all, not a part of the United Kingdom like Scotland.
The United States provides the United Kingdom with taxes and wealth in peacetime, and in the event of a defeat it can provide war compensation, or even goods if necessary.
At this moment, the words Zhu Jingyuan mentioned very casually appeared in Monroe's mind again.
"Has Mr. Monroe considered establishing an American empire belonging to the Americans, or becoming a princely vassal state of the Ming Dynasty..."
The American Empire of the Americans——
This sentence seems to have a special magic.
Ever since the partner came out of Zhu Jingyuan's mouth and entered Monroe's ears, it quickly took root in Monroe's heart.
Munro was thinking unconsciously from time to time, and another sentence was slowly brewing in his mind.
Yinzhou... No, America should be the America of Americans——
Both Europeans and Ming people should leave there——
But that's simply impossible——
According to the logic of Emperor Zhu Cixiang, the founder of the Ming Dynasty, the United States is just a dog of the United Kingdom.
Although it is more powerful, it is not as profitable as Tianzhu, so it can be discarded if necessary.
It is not unacceptable to cede a piece of land from the United States.
The value of this land itself comes from the British need to control the central coastline of Yinzhou.
Not because they are supposed to be American immigrants.
Monroe swallowed, stood up and looked at the other British representatives:
“Everyone, do you really want to hand over Florida?
“Although there are only a few people living in Florida, they are all our Thai-Spanish immigrants!
“Although Florida is underdeveloped, it is not dangerous.
"Do you still remember your original judgment that Ming Dynasty will seize Southern Tianzhu through war twenty years later?
“Tianzhu is certainly valuable, but can we in the UK hold it?
“Have you ever considered what would happen if Ming pacified other European countries and went to war with us alone?
"Have you ever considered the situation where Ming Dynasty concentrated on seizing the Tianzhu region?
“How do we in the UK respond to these situations?”
There was a brief silence.
Peter said rather reluctantly:
“If Spain changes its mind and accepts Ming’s conditions, Ming will get Texas and Cuba.
“Florida is right next to Texas and across the sea from the island of Cuba, and its security cannot be guaranteed either.
"Whether it's Florida or Southern Tianzhu, we can only hope that Ming Dynasty will keep its promise."
Monroe was silent.
But after Pete paused for a moment, he comforted himself and said:
"The Ming Dynasty may not be able to agree to this condition. I will try to persuade His Highness Prince Dashi to exchange part of the southern Tianzhu land..."
Monroe seemed to wake up instantly:
"Yes, we can work hard in this area, but I hope that I will be responsible for this task.
"It's not that I don't trust the Prime Minister's ability, but because I know the American colonies better.
"I hope that through my identity, I can add some persuasiveness..."
Peter felt that what Monroe said made sense, so he nodded and accepted it.
So Monroe and Peter confirmed some details and went to visit the palace where Zhu Jingyuan lived.
It was already evening, and Shen Fu didn't want to see any more visitors.
But when Shen Fu heard Monroe's name, he realized that Zhu Jingyuan had talked to Monroe alone.
So Shen Fu went to inform Zhu Jingyuan.
Zhu Jingyuan was a little surprised that the British sent Monroe to negotiate. At the same time, he was also curious about whether the attack he made at the beginning was of any use.
So Zhu Jingyuan came out to see him.
Monroe's mood was quite complicated, so his excessive politeness directly explained his intention:
"Your Highness, apart from handing over Southern Tianzhu, is there any room for negotiation on the conditions for Ming Dynasty to sign a permanent peace treaty with Britain?"
Zhu Jingyuan thought about the current situation for a moment.
Ming Dynasty's attitude towards Britain and France was different.
Although Britain was the organizer of the anti-Ming alliance, Britain was originally forced into a corner by Ming in order to resist Ming's suppression.
France decided on its own to reject Ming's solicitation.
When the French came to sue for peace, it was necessary to deliberately humiliate them so that they would remember this lesson.
In addition, the French mainland is already under threat from the Ming fleet, while the British mainland is still relatively safe.
Therefore, when facing the British, Zhu Jingyuan did not deliberately create difficulties and directly made a plan that had been discussed internally:
“The lands of Florida and west to the shores of the Honey River.
“All the land around Hudson Bay.
“The waters of the Honey River belong to the Ming Dynasty.
“Abandon all other undeveloped and disputed lands in Yinzhou.
"Ten million Ming Dynasty gold notes."
Zhu Jingyuan's decisiveness made Monroe feel heavy and complicated.
This condition is not much different from Peter's conjecture.
Da Mingduo wants the wasteland around Hudson Bay, which is less valuable than Florida. The British should agree without hesitation.
As for the compensation of 10 million gold coins, it is not unacceptable.
All in all, this so-called permanent peace treaty should be negotiated.
But Monro did not want to accept this condition:
"May I ask, Your Highness, whether Florida and other compensation can be replaced with part of Tianzhu's land?"
Zhu Jingyuan waved his hand without hesitation and said:
"Impossible, the Tianzhu region is the basis for ensuring peace between the Ming Dynasty and Britain, so the status quo must be maintained and it is impossible to participate in the transaction.
“The Ming Dynasty wanted to acquire Florida just to completely control the Central Yinzhou Sea, and it has little to do with the value of the land itself.
"If you, Britain, can accept this condition, then we will sign a permanent peace treaty, otherwise we will choose twenty years."
Monroe felt heavy. As expected, Ming Dynasty did not accept transactions related to Tianzhu, only the central waters of Yinzhou.
Monroe looked at Zhu Jingyuan's appearance and then looked at the surrounding environment. Except for Shen Fu, there was no one in the living room.
After thinking in silence for more than ten seconds, which made Zhu Jingyuan and Shen Fu a little irritable, Monroe uttered another sentence:
"His Royal Highness Prince Dashi, you asked me if I was interested in establishing an American empire for Americans...
"If I answer now that I am interested, can Daming provide support and still ask for the Florida area."
Zhu Jingyuan and Shen Fu were both stunned. They didn't expect that the stroke Zhu Jingyuan made at the beginning would actually work.
Zhu Jingyuan was slightly happy in his heart, but on the surface he was still very serious and responded completely naturally:
"If Mr. Monroe is really ambitious, he should support the cession of Florida, which is to your advantage.
"You can use this opportunity and excuse to inspire and launch the Americans to fight against the British colonists, and Ming Dynasty can provide support.
"If Mr. Monroe just wants to maintain the status quo, then I'm sorry, but there is no way to establish a friendship between Ming and the British dog."
Look at the Ming Dynasty 1805.8.2...m. :
